ASCE T&DI AUTOMATED PEOPLE MOVER STANDARDS COMMITTEE
MINUTES OF TORONTO MEETING Hosted by GTAA
September 22 & 23, 2005, Sheraton Gateway Hotel, Toronto Pearson Int. Airport
Attendees
Tom McGean Chairman Patrick McDermott TSSA
Larry Smith Secretary Gord Kanani TSSA
Jon Esslinger Director, T&DI Douglas Baird DIA
Mike Riseborough, GTAA Tedd Snyder, Booz Allen Hamilton
Alex Klimmer, DDC John Dexter, Booz Allen Hamilton
Al Hartkorn, Transit Safety Charles Martin L+E
Tony Garcia, Clark County Gary Houts, TPA
Bob Griebenow, Berger/Abam Mike Shumack, MCO
Gerry Winters, GTAA(part) John Champ,APM consultant
Paul Didrikson Bombardier Frank Culver, Washington Group(part)
Chuck Elm, Consultant Mike Deiparine Parametrix
Rod Falvey, L+E Jon Brackpool BAA
Darin Friedmann, Mitsubishi HI Joe Abbas URS
Peter DeLeonardis, Horton(part) Diana Morse, FAA(Part) Alex Inserto, Insul-8 Rudiger von Hovel TUV Intertraffic
Richard Prell, Insul-8 Gregg Rodgers EIWPF (part)
Lloyd Welch, Las Vegas Mono. John Quackenbush EIWPF Consultant (part)
1. OPENING: Tom McGean opened the meeting at 8:35 am, on Thursday, September 22 and welcomed the new attendees and asked the group to briefly introduce themselves. Tom asked Mike Riseborough, to inform the group of the plans of the Greater Toronto Airports Authority for the meeting, tour and social event.
2. APPROVAL OF ORLANDO MINUTES: A motion to approve the minutes from the May 5&6, 2005 meeting was made by Al Hartkorn and seconded by Alex Inserto and motion carried.
3. LOCATION/DATE OF NEXT TWO MEETINGS: The next meeting will be in Tampa, Florida, on February 9&10, 2006 in the Board Room on the 3rd floor of Tampa Int. Airport. Gary Houts distributed a draft program outline of logistics during the meeting and also requested committee comments regarding the proposed hotels as prices vary and February is “High Season” in Florida. The committee favored the economical Holiday Inn Express at $99/night plus local tax. A booking arrangement will be made and members notified of details in December.
The spring/summer meeting will be hosted by Bombardier in NYC at the end of May, 2006.Discussion followed regarding an October meeting in Asia hosted by Mitsubishi likely venue is Singapore or possibly Tokyo. Darin Friedmann will pursue options and make proposals at the Tampa meeting.
The Chairman introduced the possibility of a meeting in Vienna in conjunction with ASCE APM 07 in May 13-16, 2007 similar to the cooperative program at APM 05 in Orlando.
4. REPORT FROM IAAPMA: Mike Shumack gave a brief report indicating that the user group may be expanded to include other categories of APM operators beyond just airports. The web site is IAAPMA.org and it has a link to the ASCE web. Certain info is password access only to members.
4. CONFIGURATION CONTROL and WEB SITE REPORT: Mike Shumack restated the importance of proper documentation identification and asked that all Documents include the originators name, date, and title. Please email Mike for clarification if you are unsure of formatting protocols at . Discussion regarding problem that members have had with the ASCE Web ensued and it appears that glitches have occurred especially with member voting access. Specific member issues can only be resolved by ASCE Headquarters staff. Contact Eileen Boeing at to resolve these problems.
5. AWARDS PROGRAM: The Chairman reported that the awards fund is now restored and additional awards could be made at the Tampa meeting.
6. DATABASE REPORT: Bob Griebenow will initiate an update of the station database with the help of Mike Shumack. The Chairman will consult with Bill Hathaway regarding updates to the regulatory agency database.
7. NFPA REPORT: Rod Falvey spoke of the ongoing work of the NFPA and indicated that they seem to be heading toward a more performance based standards philosophy. Current work involves CBTC and certain modes to clarify issues with tunnels, roof structures and fire analysis. A revision is forthcoming next year.
8. MEMBERSHIP AND CHANGE OF OFFICER: The Chairman acknowledged receipt of a letter from Bob Good announcing his relocation and need to resign from the committee and his post as Vice Chair. The Chairman advised the committee that as prescribed by the bylaws and after conferring with other steering group members he had appointed Tedd Snyder to the position and that Tedd had agreed to serve.. As prescribed by the bylaws, the committee was asked to confirm the appointment which it did by unanimous consent.
9. STATUS OF PUBLIC COMMENTS ON PART ONE: The public comments are still pending due to an unforeseen delay in publication. The comments will be reviewed at the next meeting.
10. MODEL ELEVATOR CODE, (MEC), DISSCUSSION: The Chairman introduced Gregg Rogers, National Coordinator of the Elevator Industry Work Preservation Fund (EIWPF) and John Quackenbush, a consultant to the Fund, and asked that they address the committee and offer their insights regarding the MEC. Gregg Rogers took the lead accompanied by John Quackenbush and provided background on the MEC and the inclusion of APM’s in the document. The committee members asked specific questions that focused on problems associated with MEC requirements to permit only elevator qualified personnel to be used for building, testing and maintaining APMs. Discussion with the EIWPF representatives continued for 90 minutes.. Both representatives were scheduled to leave the meeting on the first day and it was beneficial for all parties to continue discussions with the originators of the EIWPF MEC.
The origins of the MEC and exactly who should be contacted to work out any conflicts was discussed.. John Quackenbush presented the secretary a written list of groups he identified as joint sponsors lobbying for adoption of the MEC. The list includes: National Elevator Industry Inc., National Association of Vertical Transportation Professionals, National Association of Elevator Safety Authorities International, Elevator Contractors of America, and the Elevator Industry Work Preservation Fund. Gregg and John said they would talk to the group and express our concerns and explore what sort of resolution strategy could be developed. Committee Chair
The Chairman tabled the remaining MEC material on the agenda to the next day..
11. INSPECTOR QUALIFICATIONS ISSUES: Al Hartkorn reintroduced the work of this task force and considerable new discussion resulted from the earlier debate regarding the MEC and its role for the QEI designation as suggested by the EIWPF Representatives. It was decided to defer action on the APM Inspector Qualifications draft pending further discovery and development of safety issues.
12. CHANGES IN PART 4 re QUALIFICATIONS: Diane Morse, Bill Showalter. Both Diane and Bill were absent and the item was deferred.
13. CHAPTER 17 (RECOMMENDED PRACTICES), LINE BY LINE REVIEW: John Dexter lead the review and upon completion, a motion was made by Chuck Elms to ballot chapter 17 , seconded by Lloyd Welch , and motion carried. The Chairman will send the final version to Jon Esslinger to proceed to ballot. It was agreed that the Chapter 17 material will be made an informative appendix of the standard and the Chair will provide words to go at the end of Chapter 14 referring to the Appendix material.
14. PRESENTATION BY GTAA AND TOUR OF THE APM SYSTEM: Gerry Winters, GTAA, made a presentation of the Toronto Pearson Int. Airport redevelopment project with previews of the DDC APM system. A comprehensive site tour of the extensive system completed the first day’s business agenda. The committee regrouped for an excellent dinner in the CN Tower hosted by GTAA.
15. REPORT of T&DI and MEMBERSHIP: Jon Esslinger distributed a 6 page report and also updated the committee on membership changes. ASCE has added 8 new members to the standards committee this past summer.
At this time, the committee make-up is in balance with about 25 Consumers, 23 Producers, 5 Regulatory, and 12 General Interest.
The APM Standards Committee continues to excel in the ASCE Electronic balloting process – the diligence of members to resolve problems is commendable and leads to continuing successful ballots per ASCE Codes and Standards Rules. Jon also related the commitment to hold ASCE APM 07 in Vienna may 13-16, 2007
16. IEC WORKING GROUP 39 & 40 REPORTS: Sam Lott submitted a letter report dated September 20, 2005, and Tom McGean read the letter to the committee. Jon Esslinger will email an electronic copy of the Lott letter to the secretary for inclusion in the minutes. Tom McGean will take an action to email contact information on accessing the IEC TC9 web site. Charlie Martin commented that progress on WG 40 appears slow. It continues to be difficult to have ASCE APM Standards Committee representation at these international working group meetings. A meeting is scheduled for Hong Kong, October 20 &21. Darin Friedmann MHI, will investigate potential representation and report to the Chairman.
17. FINAL CHANGES TO PART 2 REAFFIRMATION: Frank Culver will continue to work on the clean up of the final changes to Part 2 prior to reaffirmation. Specifically Frank will do the following: 1) incorporate into a final Part 2 draft all the changes he has documented which were discussed at the Toronto meeting. 2) Obtain the grounding interpretation ballot from Paul Didrikson and see that all necessary changes resulting from that ballot are made 3) See that words concerning the speed limitations for the APM standard are placed early in the vehicle section. 4) Check for any additional NFPA changes or updates to any other cited standards in Part 2. 5) Obtain Yves Clarissou Excel spreadsheet on structural loads which was discussed at a previous meeting and see the agreed upon changes are included in the Part 2 revisions. Coordinate this with Yves. 6) Place Peter DeLeonardis new door change into Part 2 as discussed at this meeting. When these changes are all made, Frank is to pass the draft material to Alex Inserto who will go over it all. Alex and Frank will work together to produce an agreed upon final draft for review at the next meeting..
18. RESOLUTION OF SECURITY BALLOT ISSUES: Tom McGean led the ballot resolution of comments and will issue the Official Ballot Report to Jon Esslinger. All items were resolved and only a few editorial changes were made. Tom thanked Bill Hathaway for his work in developing this chapter. Jon Esslinger will send the final report to Mike Shumack for posting.
19. NEW BUSINESS: A discussion on the options for reprinting a consolidated ASCE 21 ensued, and Jon Esslinger will investigate and report to the chairman prior to the next meeting.
A copy of the Chairman’s email letter to APTA regarding the MEC issues was given to Joe Abbas who will bring it up at the next APTA meeting. Jon will also send a PDF version of his letter to the ASME about the MEC to Al Hartkorn who will prepare a draft letter for the approval of the Chair to be possibly sent to State Oversight Agencies, advising them of the MEC.
Gary Houts will attend the next meeting of the Florida Elevator Association on October 11,2005 and will discuss the MEC issues with the new State Regulatory people.
Al Hartkorn raised questions regarding the new automatic train controls standard and suggested they be blended into chapter 14. Charlie Martin will modify tables 5.1& 5.2 to clarify the charts and correlate with IEC CBTC standard.
The Chairman requested that a task force of those members who think the Al Hartkorn draft of Qualifications needs refinement should write a joint short white paper on what inspector and auditor qualifications are needed in the standard.. It is understood that concurrence may not be possible so differing white papers are acceptable and may be submitted for consideration at the next meeting in Tampa. The following people were appointed to the above task force: Mike Shumack, Gary Houts, Tony Garcia, John Champ, Larry Smith and (although absent), Bill Showalter and Diana Morse..
CONTINUATION OF MEC DISCUSSION: A draft motion was developed and reviewed on screen. An official motion was made to communicate the motion to the EIWPF Representative and seek answers. The motion was made by Chuck Elms and seconded by Joe Abbas and carried. The motion reads:
ASCE APM Standards Committee recommends to the EIWPF:
1. A moratorium on specifying requirements for the design, construction, operations, inspection, maintenance, alteration and repair, and testing of APM systems in the MEC other than that included in ASCE 21,
Or
2. a moratorium on covering APM in the MEC
The Chair was instructed by the committee to prepare a letter thanking the EIWPF representatives for attending our meeting, and advising them of the above motion. The letter should also include copies of the motion and of the letter from the ASME stating that the QE1 is not intended for APM qualification.
Larry Smith will attend the Bridge Builder session of the Elevator Industry Joint Convention & Exposition on September 29 at the Toronto Metro Convention Center and present an agenda item discussion regarding the MEC issues as they conflict with ASCE 21
The chairman acknowledged the excellent arrangements provided by our host, GTAA, Mike Riseborough, and Gerry Winters and the DDC APM tour leaders. The Wednesday evening welcome dinner, the Thursday evening dinner at the CN tower, and the pre-meeting breakfasts and lunches were outstanding. The guest trip to Niagara Fall and the Vinyard were surly appreciated by all.
Meeting adjourned at 3:30 pm.