Cowichan LakeResearch Station,MesachieLake

Hosted by MalaspinaUniversityCollege


Michel ValleeMUC (Chair)Candace ParsonsUBC

Kelly HatfullBCIT (Minutes)Peter BarssBCIT

Peter SchroderSelkirkKen TaylorNVIT

Richard ChesterBCITEd MorriceCNC

Greg LayNLCBarry OstrandMUC

Al JohnsonNLCJim WilkinsonMUC

Tom HedekarMUCLinda KaivantoM of Ed.

Sandra LottMOFRalph ArchibaldFPBranch

Staffan LindgrenUNBC

Welcome – Michel Vallee, Chair

Meeting opened by Michel Vallee. Introductions by all members present.

Housekeeping issues, including, invoicing for the Mesachie Lake Research Centre (room and board) has been directly to Malaspina. All schools to refund MUC at $155 / person.

Changes & Approval of 2006 Agenda – Chair Michel Vallee

The final 3 items for today’s agenda will be delayed till June 14th after the school reports (i.e. the election of a new Chair, and next year’s meeting selection.)

Motion 06.01.01
To approve 2006 meeting agenda
Moved by Greg Lay, Seconded by Ken Taylor.

Approval of 2005 meeting minutes – Chair Michel Vallee


  1. Page 1: Change Rick Chester’s school of employment to BCIT (not Selkirk)
  2. Bottom of 2nd to Last Page: Ed Morrice letter was sent to Dwight Yochim (ABCFP) and Roxanne Comeau (CIF).
  3. 3rd to last paragraph on page 6: Rick Chester’s comment of ‘small approach’ refers to a specific focus rather than a general view.
  4. Recommend page numbers on 2006 minutes.

Motion 06.01.02
To approve the 2005 meeting minutes with corrections
Moved by Peter Schroder, Seconded by Greg Lay

2005 Minutes – Action Reports – Michel Vallee

(See attached list)

Action Item #

  1. Tom Hedekar sent letters to the Technical schools, limited response and varied depth; therefore lost momentum. Tom is still interested in submitting article in the ABCFP magazine ‘BC Forest Professional.’

Candice suggested more of a story format rather than statistics.

Ed suggested having an undergrad student (in History or Journalism) organize and develop as a student project.

FOLLOW-UP ACTION #1: Tom to e-mail the request for a specific format and information by June 23/06. Focus the article to Forestry Week in Sept 2007.

  1. No further action required to promote applications, due to overwhelming influx of Technicians registering to become Registered Forest Technologists.
  1. No further action required; completed.
  1. Ongoing review on promoting forestry careers.

FOLLOW-UP ACTION #2: Need to assess what resources are available already. Format to choose such as print, CD, DVD, etc. Tie into Provincial Recruitment Strategy focus and curriculum development. There is approximately $4000 funding made available at the ABCFP Convention meeting in Nanaimo.

  1. N/A – No copy finalized in Action Item #4.
  1. Contact list to be updated

FOLLOW-UP ACTION #3: Rick Chester to use the ‘blog’ format. Rep from each school to send faculty list and courses taught to the new Chair for distribution. Excel format may still be used depending on each school’s ability to ‘blog.’

  1. Drop action, as we have new direction in Action #6.
  1. Completed.
  1. Completed.
  1. Forest Safety Council (FSC): Discussion concerning Forest Training (EG falling). Training Outcomes need to focus on all supervisors, not just Silviculture Supervisors. There is a desire to have ‘Certified’ status, but format is not completed, and deliver to Technical school level. NorthIslandCollege has a ‘Request for Proposal.’ The required 500m3 / student faller is not feasible.

FOLLOW-UP ACTION #4: Letter to be drafted byPeter Barssand Greg Lay to focus on faller safety training for all Supervisors in forestry. FSC will be contacted by Chair to request a post-secondary representative to have a seat on the FSC Board (Motion later in meeting minutes).

  1. Completed. Letter sent to CIF and ABCFP.

BCCAT Report – David Drakeford

Cross Canada participation from 32 institutions; working well in BC, but not in Ontario.

Check the website (May 2006 copy attached).

There are 90 articulation committees.

(See David’s attached notes).

No significant articulation issues; however key items discussed were:

  • Core competency matrix,
  • Best practices,
  • Handbook for Articulation meetings (copy to be given to new Chair), and
  • Keep it relevant and up to date.

Dave is the Administrator (Systems Liaison).

National Forestry Recruitment Initiative – Candace Parsons

BC was represented by 4 attendees, including Candace. The highlights are as follows:

  • White paper (latest version attached) distributed by the CIF (April 2006)
  • Web site links by CIF
  • CCFM seed money to kick start BC Group for a Business Plan.
  • National marketing campaign (independent by province and tied together)

Key Item: Pursue a Forest Sector Council using the seed funding (federal-$5000 and provincial-$2500) to develop the Business Plan for pursuit of the larger funding. ABCFP (Jerome Marburg) and CIF (Roxanne Comeau) developing Business Plan.

A paid consultant (Al Gorley) is already working on the collecting and presenting of information relevant to the business plan creation.

There will be a conference call on June 21/06 with the National Council (Brad Henry, CFS / FN, and the National Aboriginal Forestry Association (NAFA).

Need seed money from industry as well (P. Barrs), as they are the benefactors of trained personnel available in the future. For example, Ainsworth Lumber wrote a cheque to keep the forestry program at Grand PrairieCollege afloat due to a shortage for Alberta Forest Technologists.

The Ministry of Forests & Range position on recruitment – Ralph Archibald

The MOF is aware, but not enough attention to address 3-year work force shortfall.

Need a different model to deal with present and future trained worker shortage for such positions as truck drivers, mill workers, and reforestation workers.

Stress leave is increasing in the FP Branch and other MOF divisions as positions are vacant through attrition and the remaining work is pushed upon the remaining workers.

For example, by 2010, 26% of the present MOF work force will be eligible for retirement. The Forest Practices Branch will face a 65% retirement eligibility factor in 2010.

The MOF will celebrate their 100th anniversary in 2012, and will face the following

Key Issues:

  • Sustainability
  • Water / environmental protection
  • Fish, Wildlife & Recreation
  • Industry (business management)
  • Marketing of forest products
  • Policy development
  • Tenure reform
  • Technology adjustment
  • FPAC (Forest Products Association of Canada) Issues:
  • Customer focus
  • Global leader in technology and innovation,
  • Social / environmental performance
  • Changing competition
  • World view

Revitalization Plan (Road to the future): The MOF wants to be an ‘employer of choice’ by reflecting on:

  • Leadership
  • Learning organization
  • Workplace wellness (safe & life-balanced)
  • Workforce Planning (skill set teams)
  • Performance Planning
  • Continuous improvement
  • Time lines
  • Support
  • Recruiting & maintenance of staff

Business Mapping and Program Management: important tools for post-secondary schools to teach.

FSC meetings to focus on reducing accidents and increase the planning stage of safety.


  • Definition and application (unknown in post-secondary)
  • Understanding decision-making tools / process
  • FN relationships are increasing, yet still not known well on how to create a win-win situation with integration into forestry programs and industry.
  • Reduced decision making by the MOF, and more on monitoring and enforcement.

Job Eligibility: Need to recruit recent forestry graduates rather than the present Licensed Science Officer (LSO) level.

Committee Discussion items discussed with Ralph Archibald

  • Third party deliverables are a key part of the MOF business, however contractor and consultant’s difficulty to find trained and experienced workers not being recognized directly by MOF.
  • Need to launch a ‘Junior Ranger’ Program employing 150 students around BC using the Environment conservation model (BC Conservation Foundation Model); i.e. one for all resource sectors to work from.
  • The BC MOF application takes 3 hours to fill out, as compared to the related Alberta government form taking a minor fraction of the time. Need to streamline.
  • Connecting with the different organizations regionally and provincially.
  • Community Forests Association (EG BurnsLake support for the Junior Forest Wardens

Provincial Forestry Recruitment Initiative

  • Provincial Strategy – Peter Barss
  • Presently receiving drafts.
  • Al Gorley hired to run and document meeting.
  • Draft discussion paper released in March 2006 (date, actions, and structure).
  • Poor response from industry on questionnaire, possibly due to format of questions and direct request for specific resource support. No update (Candace has notes).

Group discussion points:

  • Seed people (i.e. leg work, not just money).
  • Improve discussion paper.
  • Issue of qualified worker shortages, and difficulty to track with many small contractors / consultants.
  • Holes in data (i.e. grads produced Vs grads required)
  • National Forest Minister’s paper (needs).
  • Different school strategies (what works and doesn’t?).
  • Al Gorley needs to talk to schools.
  • CIF website (data from National meeting).
  • Job security issues and permancy issue (i.e. smaller companies may only hire contract by contract): therefore good people leaving the industry.
  • Industry not supporting upgrading anymore (i.e. want pre-certified and qualified, and experienced).
  • Trades are taking people away from forestry, due to immediate pay back; i.e. ‘apprentice and get paid.’ while working (Possible solution: summer job credit to mimic apprenticeship advantages).
  • WCB regulations need to change to allow people <19 years old to fight fire.
  • Emphasize with a strong message on conservation, leadership and sustainability to encourage more candidates with a broader interest.
  • List the number of jobs not filled at each school:

Provincial Strategy – Peter Barss (cont’d)

& Education Working Group – Linda Kaivanto

  • Template for summarizing each school capacities and actual student numbers job postings template (See attached spread sheet for final details from P. Barss or L. Kaivanto).
  • Need one web site on a provincial level to link all career opportunities, schools, and related links
  • BCCAT is a well-organized web site however the search engine won’t respond to the key words that will connect to the site.
  • If a web surfer can’t find the website in 3 steps, the majority of people will cease trying.For example, type into a search engine ‘BC Forest Education’ and you only get UBC and UNBC. ABCFP website is set up for a specific audience, and less for promotion of forestry. The website needs to address the following basic questions:
  • Are there jobs and what type would I qualify for?
  • Will I be certified that the industry wants? (University Vs Technology?)
  • What is the breakdown for full-time, part-time, temporary, and permanent?
  • Who would I work for?
  • How much do I get paid?
  • Where do I work (locally, provincially, nationally, and internationally)?
  • What prerequisites do I need, and what is the associated mark?
  • How much is it to go to school / accommodation? What happens on campus?
  • What are the advantages to go into this career or go to this school?
  • Can I get a related job before I graduate or before coming to your school?
  • What kind of credits can I get for other post secondary courses or high school forestry programs?
  • FOLLOW-UP ACTION #5: Collectively give Al Gorley information from each school rep (Note: What time line is Al Gorley on?). Rick Chester to help other schools get familiar with the ‘Blog’ concept of inserting more information and updating more easily.
  • Provincial Task Force:
  • TLA, Forest Contractors Assoc, and Western Silviculture Assoc are some of the members on the task force.
  • Need industry reps to participate, and understand the employment shortage situation immediately.
  • Need the MOF to be the ‘seed’ agency for a budget request (multi-year development) Present budget to develop the Business Plan is a one-shot deal

Motion 06.01.03
To create a forest education web portal using a simple 1-page connection with general industry / career information and strong links to BC forestry schools.
Moved by Ed Morrice, Seconded by Peter Schroder.

FOLLOW-UP ACTION #6: Candace Parsons to initiate discussions in getting quote estimates for creating a portal web site

Ministry of Advanced Education (AVED) – Linda Kaivanto

Minister and Deputy Minister

  • current Minster of is the Honourable Murray Coell
  • new Deputy Minister, Moura Quayle, was appointed last summer; she has an educational background (formerly Dean of the Faculty of Agricultural Sciences, UBC) ; and expresses a strong interest in assisting the institutions to deliver world-class education

Post Secondary Education: Issues and Activities Update, May 2006
(see attached for copy - 10 pages)

Ministry Review Process: Evolving AVED

Over the past year, the Ministry has undergone a full review of its key values and principles of operation and identified the following 5 Guiding Principles:

  1. “think like a student” to support student success
  2. Flexibility to adapt to changing business environments
  3. To be policy-driven, providing excellent counsel to government
  4. Fiscal responsibility and strategic management of spending
  5. To encourage shared leadership to leverage our diverse talents

Divisions (3)

This review process has resulted in a significant re-organization with 3 Divisions:

(see attached for copy of AVED executive organization chart or link to AVED website)

  • Post Secondary Education – Assistant Deputy Minister (ADM)is Ruth Wittenberg
  • Students and Learning – Tom Vincent, ADM
  • Research, Technology and Innovation – new division to profile these areas as they are government priority; national search is underway for a new ADM

Program Responsibilities: now divided between the following 2 divisions:

  • Post Secondary Education – Colleges and University Colleges Branch: majority of programs including Forestry/Natural Resources (Regional Institutions Unit), and Universities and Institutes Branch: nursing programs and general academic programs in arts and sciences (excluding professional/applied degree programs)
  • Students and Learning – Learning Programs Branch: Aboriginal programs and initiatives and Developmental programs (ABE, ASE, ELT and Literacy)

New AVED Teams (3)

  • Aboriginal Team
  • Literacy Team
  • Northern Team –; to assist institutions to improve post secondary education in the north: CNC, NLC, NWCC and UNBC (Linda K is on this team)

International Education

Now government priority supported by new initiatives

Ministry of Advanced Education (AVED) – Linda Kaivanto (cont’d)

Post Secondary Budget Review (Perrin Report #1)

Government announced limit on tuition fee increases in last year’s throne speech

  • As institutions prepared 2005/06 budgets without prior knowledge of this limit, government/AVED committed to provide appropriate compensation
  • For 2005/06, a $30 million base operating grant adjustment was approved for UBC, SFU, UVic, UNBC and BCIT
  • Consultant is reviewing impact at other institutions and Perrin Report #2 will be forthcoming this summer

Education and Training Consortia

AVED has established three consortia – to work with sector stakeholders to study labour market needs and develop training strategies to address them

  1. BC Aerospace Strategy and Consortium – focus on aircraft maintenance training; new funding for new and expanded facilities built at BCIT, UCFV, NLC and Okanagan College (Vernon); institutions cover the cost of program expansion with existing FTE funding (base operating grants)
  2. BC Oil and Gas Education and Training Consortium – new $12 million facility for oil and gas training at the Fort St. John Campus of NLC; AVED provided $6 million, industry partners have committed contributions of up to $5.9 million in matching funds; and further donations from industry and other sources are under discussion.
  3. BC Tourism and Hospitality Consortium – two new training centres established to focus on 2010 Olympics; Tourism at CapilanoCollege and Hospitality at VCC

Expand BSF Programs

Government’s Plan for Forestry includes: “To expand forestry programs at UNBC and UBC to train more professional foresters and address other critical shortages in forestry”.

  • BSF program will be expanded to graduate more potential RPF’s; however there is not recognition to the shortfall of applicants, and hence still the same problem.
  • Sandra Lott, Ministry of Forests and Range (MoFR) wants industry to come to the table with the Deputy Minister to help address the shortfall issues and the solutions.

Issues: - Discussion

  • Mathematics (high school) issue: The Prince George school district only offers two maths (Principles and Essentials) and not Math Applications which is key to having more graduates in the forestry field. According to Dave D, there is a shortage of high school math instructors in BC (Canada?).
  • FTE’s may mean programs being cut; i.e. not reopening programs if closed
  • Reduced standards of academic prerequisites are not working due to increased failures in post secondary. It will take 2 years to turn around. According to Candace, UBC has raised their prerequisite marks in the last few years with no change to the number of BSF graduates.

Core Competency requirements for RFT entrants – Rick Chester (for Norm Shaw)

(See attached notes)

The Articulation Committee officially thanks the following people for their extraordinary efforts in overturning the CTAB decision of requiring Calculus in Forest Technology:

  • Jerome Marburg, ABCFP
  • Norman Shaw, ABCFP / BCIT
  • Geoff Sale, CTAB

Issue: CTAB has a shortfall in their auditing system to ensure consistency of evaluating forest technology programs (i.e. variable accreditation success with programs that are varied in the delivery, yet considered equivalent). Peter Yanciw’s creation of a BCIT program matrix has reduced the effort to locate and assess course learning outcomes, and has been shared with the other schools.

CTAB, according to Tom Hedekar was designed to certify Engineering programs, not Natural Resources programs; hence the difficulties to audit.

Funding is required to improve the accreditation process into a final product. (Note: funding will be for a new matrix, and won’t fund the maintenance of a transfer matrix).

Funding may be available if deadline date is flexible (Candace Parsons).

BCIT’s Jennifer Odom (sp?) may be available to help the process.

Proposal (Step 3 Motion): Discussion

  • CTAB funding is not possible (Geoff Sales)
  • BCCAT process?
  • No objections to Motion

FOLLOW-UP ACTION #7: Rick Chester to submit Step 3 Motion for cut & paste into minutes.