March 22, 1965
Orem City Council met in regular session Monday, March 22, 1965 at 7:00 p.m. in the Council Chambers. Present were Mayor G. Milton Jameson, Chairman; Councilman Dixon Larson, Harley Gillman, Paul Washburn, Lowell Thomson and James Paramore; City Manager Earl Wengreen, Attorney Vern Wentz, Acting Engineer Chester Kocherhans, Treasurer Victor Christensen and Virginia Wilkins, Others present were:
Clyde WeeksW. H. PhillipsBob Luck
C. M. WahlquistVictor ChristensenRay Hanks
Bob HealeyBert HuishMrs. Ray Hanks
Con BradyMr. & Mrs. R. B. AdamsRichard Hanks
Kay HuffDagmar FenleyMrs. Richard Hanks
Chester KocherhansIrene GaleE. E. Twitchell
DeLynn HeapsLuther GaleRay Cordner
Ralph BrownClaude WarnerGrant Rowley
Donald D. NoelAngie WarnerFern Rowley
Fay R. JohnsonPhyllis PetersonLeah Johnson
Don EvansMarilyn ChristensenWilliam Alvari
David D. ShurtliffMarilyn MansfieldMitchell Sawaya
Robert L. BrownMaxine KendallRichard Park
Lowell R. TingelKenneth KendallThomas Jacob
H. Grant WatkinsMary Jean CarpenterMyrl Jacob
Marvin BurgonW. W. CarpenterDale Larson
David GrowHarry E. ChittockRonald Schibness
D. Spencer GrowEmma ChittockGary Bascom
Josephine ZimmermanRonald C. MansfieldDon Robertson
Lynn D. FrancomWilliam B. SumsionEd Christensen
James M. DavisMaurine Sums ionVirgil Johnason
T. E. RigbyS. Arvid DodgeLyle McDonald
Moroni JensenStella HatchPaul Jacobsen
Paul E. AndersonLloyd AndersenMariba Jacobsen
Oscar AndersonCarma W. AndersenArvilla Jacobsen
Charles E. RohbockC. Wilford LarsenDeVon M. Ogden
Bob EvansChester GraffH. B. Sumner
Alice ThatcherRichard BensonJ. L. Barnum
Stan ThatcherGeraldine BensonDale Yearsley
DeLone MuirIla HeapsAudene Yearsley
Elmo R. MuirMelva HeapsMrs. David Schulthess
Jim PyneLois MillerJohn S. Stringham
Gene L. MadsenLeona PrestwichMrs. David A Taylor
Jud MannElwood SundbergNewell A. Johnson
Keith SmithLuJean SundbergJoy A. Johnson
Arthur RichinsJames ClarkJoseph E. Wyatt
Edythe EricksonB. M. JolleyJack K. Hansen
C. F. EricksonEmily LongRichard V. Heaps
D. J. ThomasSarah GordonNoal K. Hatch
LaVon HarrisMary GillmanMike & Hazel Cook
Fielding H. HarrisJohn HushMiels Andersen
Etta S. StrongFawn HuishIvy Beckman
Hewitt M. StrongWinston CrawfordVenice Rogers
H. E. JohnsonScott WilkinsonRobert C. Rogers
Wayne C. CloseDee PyneDale Kerby
Mollie Alred-;Lloyd PettyVirginia Petty
Zillah KerbyStanley T. FarleyJuna C. Washburn
Joe KerbyDouglas RowleyFlorine Pierce
Duane D. RoylanceDonald L. TittleOwen Pierce
Robert J. DoveRoland S. StrongOlie S. Allen
William A. YonallyCleo M. WebbMaurine J. Robins
Robert K. PeperClifton M. PyneHelen Thomas
Joe B. ThurmanBlaine D. WebbMarion Clark
Glenn AikenRichard W. RobinsLela C. Goodrich
Leon AikenD. Eldon ThomasLaPriel Pulver
Kieth NielsenOrville K. HarrisReid E. Pulver
Merrill J. HermansenJack KoffordJohn Quist
Dorothy FarnworthLuther RodabaughSterling Harding
Philip P. TaylorMeredith C. StrattonDennis Zubeck
Alvin M. Washburn
The names of all of those present were not obtained.
Meeting opened with prayer by Paul Washburn.
The question of health insurance was discussed. City Manager Wengreen reported that a vote has been obtained from the City employees and that the majority had voted to continue with full coverage Blue Cross with the employees paying for the rate increase. The question of asking for bids from other companies was discussed, but it was decided this would be unnecessary, since the majority of employees voted to keep Blue Cross. Motion was made by James Paramore to accept the vote of the employees on health insurance. Motion was seconded by Dixon Larson and passed.
Motion was made by Dixon Larson to follow the plan to raise the salary of Chester Kocherhans to $620.00 as recommended by the City Manager. Motion was seconded by Paul Washburn and passed unanimously.
Chester Kocherhans reported that after studying the possibility of installing a sewer line on 1200 North between 200 and 400 East, it was decided this should be postponed until there are enough homes to justify the cost.
Mr. Kocherhans also reported on the 1600 North bridge. He stated that there are so many projects going now that he feels it would be better to wait until fall to do the work of extending the piers. It could then be budgeted in the next budget. Clegg Construction has agreed to do the work for the same price in the Fall if we want to wait. The engineer was advised to get a written agreement to this effect.
Motion was made by Paul Washburn to accept the recommendation of the engineer on the 1600 North bridge. Motion was seconded by Lowell Thomson and passed unanimously.
The City Manager reported that Calvin Bird, a City employee with 8 years’ service had a serious brain operation and that he has been off work on sick leave for 2½ months. He can now return to work on a limited basis. His problem is that he blacks out with no warning, so he can no longer drive a truck. Motion was made by James Paramore to work with Mr. Bird so that he can work on a limited basis. Motion was seconded by Harley Gillman and passed unanimously.
The City Manager reported that the water bills have arrived and the DHI Computing Service will get them out this week. Because of the delay, another bill will go out in about ten days. After that, they should go out about the 5thof the month.
City Manager Wengreen reported that a new animal control officer, Gary Guymon, has been hired. He further stated that he had contacted Mayor Dixon of Provo about an agreement for housing and extermination of animals. He referred him to their animal control officer and Lt. Baker, who is in charge of the animal control. They feel that an agreement can be worked out, if it is desired.
Motion was made by Lowell Thomson to pay Fuhriman and Rollins the final payment of $1,000.00 on the APW project. Motion was seconded by James Paramore and passed unanimously.
At 8:00 p.m. motion was made by Harley Gillman that the meeting recess and be continued at the Little Theatre of the Orem High School for the Public Hearing. The motion was seconded by James Paramore and passed.
The meeting reconvened at the Orem High School for the Public Hearing on the question of extending the C-3 Zone in the area of the proposed shopping center at 1300 South State.
Mayor Jameson welcomed the large crowd to the meeting and thanked Principal Pyne for making it possible to hold the meeting at Orem High School. Mayor Jameson stated that each side would be given an opportunity to speak and then questions could be asked.
Adrian Wright, a Salt Lake businessman who is working with local men, Ralph Brown and DeLynn Heaps, explained that they are planning if this property is rezoned. He reported that they have options on approximately 72 acres on which they plan to build a regional shopping center. This shopping center construction costs exceed ten million dollars. They have a commitment from one of the West's leading department stores and they in turn have a commitment from another store. Others will join the shopping mall later. There will be a need for about 1,000 people to man the center with a payroll of approximately $4,000,000. The main issue now is the zoning, but they will not undertake the development for about 1½ to 2 years. Mr. Wright said they want to make a development that will benefit the whole county. He said there will four square feet of parking area to one square foot of sales area. The parking area will be black-topped and lighted; there will be a non-climbable fence around the area; they hope to landscape and make it attractive. They will place the buildings in the center of the area and have 200 to 300 feet between buildings and homes. They hope to acquire all the homes that are within the bounds of the area; there are three yet to be acquired. Mr. Wright stated they are willing to pay a reasonable price, even go higher for inconvenience. He further said he felt this is an once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to have such a development as this come to an area classed as a distressed area. Mr. Wright concluded with the statement that such a development would bring about $500,000 revenue to the City each year.
At this point, the meeting was opened to questions and comments from the audience.
Ray Cordner, 1112 South 500 East: Will the fence be solid or chain link? Mr. Wright: I don't want to make a commitment; however, it will be a non-climbable. Mr. Cordner: where will the entrances be? Mr. Wright: We will have to work that out with the traffic people.
Dale Larsen, 725 East 1200 South: I would also be interested in the fence and the way to get back to the highway. Would I have to go to 800 East and back around: Mr. Wright: In all probability, 1200 South will be closed.
Richard Hanks, 495 East 1010 South: If the area is zoned this way and developed, what redistribution of traffic of children to school would be made? It would be hazardous going through this area. Mayor Jameson: When the interchange goes through on 1300 South, we will have this problem whether the shopping center goes in or not. There might be a possibility of an underpass for the school children such as Provo built on 500 West. Regardless of a shopping center, this will be a problem and will have to be handled by traffic engineers.
Ronald Scribness: If the shopping center goes in and a fence goes around the parking area, this should eliminate going through the parking area. Is the money available for this development? Mr. Wright: It will be if it is zoned.
Ronald Mansfield: I will be looking out at this parking area. If shopping malls are so popular and people will continue for the next decade to use them, why do they have to fight for the area? They have told us from a feasibility study this is the No. 1 spot in Utah. If they move any place else in the City, they would encounter the same problem. Why can't they go across from the Post Office? There are 100 acres there.Mr.Wright:This is the No. 1 spot.
Mayor Jameson: If you folks do not accept this, these people will go to Provo. If this goes to Provo, it will be the end of Orem.
Bill Alvari: I am leery of shopping centers. I live adjacent to a rezoned area. When they rezoned that area that was the No. 1 spot. Everyone wants a shopping center; they rezone and nothing happens. We need a shopping center and we need the tax, but let's have something concrete.
James Paramore: I would like to say something in defense of this action. This other area was rezoned before by another council and no stipulation was made. We are trying not to make a mistake, so the Council has made the stipulation that if the mall does not go forward, the area would revert back to the original zone.
W. W. Carpenter: I bought in an area zoned for residential. If this is rezoned out of R-1, is there any spot where we can be sure it will not be rezoned? Harley Gillman: There is no place in the world if the State Road decides to put a road through.
Mayor Jameson: Our economic system has changed. We have no problem until people come. If you want to go where there are no problems, go where there are no people.
Gary Bascom: I live adjacent to the proposed parking lot. We are being told if land isn't bought in Orem, they will go somewhere else. Why couldn't it be put in some area already zoned? If people will drive a long way to shop, they will drive to another area.
Don Robertson: You say you do not want to put it somewhere else because of the 1300 South Interchange. How about 800 East 800 North properties adjacent to the interchange. Since the 1300 South interchange is the reason, have you considered the No. 2 spot to be 1300 South west of the highway?
Mr. Wright: There is not enough property; the railroad tracks run through.
Bob Evans: As time changes everything else changes. The 800 North interchange won't do for this development. The only possible way to prevent rezoning such as this is to engulf our whole area with homes.
Jim Clark: I have probably seen more progress in Orem than anyone else. If we pass this opportunity up, we will be passing the best opportunity that has ever come to Orem. Many opposed the steel plant, but I think the steel plant has done more for Utah County than any other thing. Everything hurts someone, but I am for this 100 per cent.
Kenneth Kendall: Because of a jog in property, this will not only put this in my back yard but also down the side. Could some arrangement be made to compensate for this? Mr. Wright: We will be glad to talk to you about it.
Mr. Art Richins, representing the property owners on 750 East, gave their views on the question. He stated that there are five R-1 zones in Orem with this being the largest. He said that if someone came to Orem with a proposition, all the R-1 zones could be rezoned and he asked the Council to consider another location. He quoted from the February Orem-Geneva Times when there was a hearing on rezoning 800 North. He quoted statements by the Council opposing more commercial property in Orem.
Mr. Richins continued by stating that he had been to Salt Lake and talked with people in the Cottonwood Mall area. He said without exception these people felt they were not given a proper buffer zone. He said the property owners are not opposed to the shopping center, but feel they must be protected. Is 1000 South being proposed to be opened?
Harley Gillman: We have talked about it, but have no plans at this time.
Art Richins The traffic in Salt Lake in the Cottonwood area has tripled. Some residents have asked if you are planning to rezone where they live. If so, they wonder about the fence; would this surround them? Mayor Jameson: That question is difficult to answer at the present time. We had hoped people in the area would sell their homes and there would be no such question.
Richard Hanks: I am interested in the question of 1000 South as shown on the map. I believe it was pointed out that plans call for entrance from U.S. 91 and from the freeway access. Would you need any entrance from the North? Mr. Wright: We feel this is a matter for the traffic experts.
Mayor Jameson: The zoning of homes in the area is done to make it legal. The Council can take from the proposed area change but cannot add to it. The property of home owners can be deleted if they so desire. This is a decision for the Council.
Ed Christensen: Who is responsible to determine access to the area? Mayor Jameson: It will be by recommendation from engineers and the Planning Commission, but the decision must come from the City Council. Ed Christensen: Will there be another hearing? Mayor Jameson: No other hearing. The recommendation will come from our Planning Commission. I would like to report for Marjorie Gunn. She called me and is unable to be here. She is fully in accord with this development, if 100% back of it.
Ronald Mansfield: As property owners, we know what we are going to give up. What is the Council going to pay? If this is rezoned there will be no reason to ever build a home in Orem again.
Councilman Lowell Thomson stated that as changes come, zoning changes have to be made frequently. The Council has to look at each situation and see if it is for the good of the City and for future development.
Richard Hanks: As I get the picture now the developers are not sure where the entrances will be. To answer this there must be a study by the traffic engineers. I think it would be wise to have a traffic study made and see where the entrances are to be made.
Mayor Jameson: This is a good suggestion.
Ronald Scribness: How many of you are satisfied with the tax structure, your water bill, the cost to live in Orem? At the present time the Fire Department is poor. We need five fire houses, yet we have one. If we want taxes to increase, stay as we are and let business go to Provo and Salt Lake. If we want to have more revenue, let's have this mall and not push it out.
John Quist: There is much interest in shopping malls. My home was in California. I have been in Orem nine years. There are many such shopping malls in California. The homes have increased in value. Clean blacktop is a beautification. I support the mall 100%.
Mr. Carpenter: We have been led to understand this is the best area because of the 1300 South access.
Mr. Wright: This is one of the main reasons.
Councilman Paramore explained that now Orem City does not have nearly enough funds to provide things needed in the City. He said he hoped we are lucky enough to get this shopping mall so we can buy everything in Orem and get the revenue needed to operate the City. If we are going to progress, we feel this is a Godsend to our community.
Chester Graff: There are two things Orem is going to suffer from; a decrease in farming, there is sorespot of old trees. Farming is going out of Orem. Subdivisions are deteriorating. These two factors will kill Orem.
B. M. Jolley: I moved to Orem in 1919, the year Orem was incorporated. There have been many bitter battles. When the town was incorporated, many people didn't think this was the thing to do and from 800 South they withdrew. After a few years, the water was established and after one annexation after another, all of them are back. We had a bitter battle when Deer Creek came. The case went to the U.S. Supreme Court. Many people were required to sell their homes when the Steel Plant came. I think most of them were adequately paid and better off. Twenty years ago we had a battle when they wanted to rezone for business along the highway. Some wanted to centralize it from 800 North to 800 South. Sentiment was such that the whole five miles was zoned into business. The future of Orem lies in business. I don't think progress has come without injuring some. We can't afford to pass this up. I am sympathetic to those who are affected. For the general good of all, I feel the Council should take care of these folks and hold the injury to a minimum. The good is so great; we must not turn it down.