Alert: This is a formal class on principals underlying the Torah as found in the classic text, Derech Hashem. Please limit room text to questions on the subject matter being discussed at the time. We will have 2 breaks for questions on the mic, 30 seconds each.
Alert: Redottext is currently on.
BCWoman61: chag samaech jacqueline, Yehoshua and home
Isibel: Shalom Yehoshua
Isibel: So I have a question
BEHANU: The instructor has a question ... uh oh
Isibel: Would people like me to read through the introduction
BEHANU: Ramchal's Intro -- yes
BEHANU: not the book intro
BEHANU: my 2 cents
Isibel: Ok
Isibel: anyone else?
BEHANU: anyone else??
dawidh_nz: i second the cents of behanu
BEHANU: haha
jacqueline_54_1953: same to you , BC.. I am running late.. still stuffing my face. but wanted to make sure I got in
SueAna: 1
Isibel: This sond is a niggun
Isibel: song
SHeMABruce: The intro? Yes. good idea
BCWoman61: no fair Behanu, your two cents weigh more than the rest of ours together
BEHANU: jackie ... chew, swallow, repeat
SHeMABruce: in my opinion
Isibel: Ok thanks bruce
BEHANU: Not with my wife BC
jacqueline_54_1953: lol behanu..
BEHANU: worth a half shekel
BEHANU: old shekel
SueAna: altho the music is good too
SueAna: lol
beowulf44: lets dance
BEHANU: This tune is a niggun
BEHANU: hum along
BEHANU:
SHeMABruce: Isibel, just so you know, I weld my admin sword often and swiftly.
BEHANU: yes dance music!
BEHANU: THE SWORD OF BRUCE!
jacqueline_54_1953: lol bruce . so does she
Isibel: Great Bruce that is important
Isibel:
BEHANU: WELCOME! This is a formal class on principals underlying the Torah as found in the classic text, Derech Hashem. Please limit room text to questions on the subject matter being discussed at the time. We will have 2 breaks for questions on the mic, 30 seconds per person. Class info at - class begins at 9 pm eastern.
SHeMABruce: but if auto redots are placed when people enter the room, my sword will likely collect no blood
Isibel: One last song after this and then Ill stop the music
BCWoman61: Isibel, I remember the last time you did this in a locked room. I am glad the room is open this time
BEHANU: my 9 yr old just pointed out the number of people in the room is posted at top ... i dont need to count by hand .... duh
Isibel: Yes, well my whole understanding has changed alot since then
Isibel: Its more than worth going through the book more than once
SHeMABruce: well, i just learned something also from you child, behanu. lol
BCWoman61: trust a young one to know the technology Behanu
BEHANU: Everyone ready for their first "shock treatment?" LOL
beowulf44: 36 peeps in the room? kewl
Isibel: Remember, first and formost I am not here to convert you to my way of thinking
BCWoman61: hello beo. Chag samaech
SHeMABruce: just before it starts everyone needs to send out invites
beowulf44: ty bc woman, chag sameach
SHeMABruce: i will
SHeMABruce: Really folks, this is an ENORMOUSLY useful topic of study. You will all be blessed by it and will learn a LOT
BEHANU: Bruce is just asking for it ...
BCWoman61: Stiff competition since hamekane is debating Rock Guitarist in another room on yshu hanotzri in the oral traditions
BEHANU: Hey
BEHANU: I know this tune!
BEHANU: MATISYAHU
Isibel: and also not trying to get anyone to agree with what the Ramchal is saying, there are things that may be very difficult for people to take as thier own belief, but I ask only that you try and understand things from the perspective of the Ramchal
BEHANU: This is very cool
SHeMABruce: ENGLISH!!!
SHeMABruce: lol
Isibel: LOL
SHeMABruce: i can understand it now! lol
Isibel: yes
Isibel: Lashon Kodesh is understood by some part of you Bruce
BEHANU: This song is getting mega airplay on secular stations
beowulf44: matisyahu...the rappin chassidic
SHeMABruce: i like this song.
Alert: An admin joined the room: David_42
SHeMABruce: never heard it
BCWoman61: his style has changed some since he broke on the scene, but he has good messages
Wesleyismyname: what is the name of this
beowulf44: yes, matisyahu always sings good messages....callin g for Messiah to come in several
Isibel: It is called "One Day" on the Light cd
jacqueline_54_1953: westly in the room title..
BCWoman61: hello lev, chag samaech
Isibel: by Matisyahu
SHeMABruce: wow. i REALLY like this song!
jacqueline_54_1953: ohh sorry you are asking about the song
Wesleyismyname: the song
BCWoman61: hello warrior, chag samaech
Isibel: Its my Derech HaShem theme song
Isibel: LOL
Isibel: it really is if you read the lyrics
SHeMABruce: good one isibel
BEHANU: theme song eh?
beowulf44: deep lyrics
BEHANU: i thought it was gonna be that tune from Veggie Tales
Isibel: LOL
BEHANU: LOL
SHeMABruce: ok. where can i get this song. it gets me teary eyed.
BEHANU: Don't !
BEHANU: Play that
BEHANU: isis
BEHANU: isibel
YehoshuaBA: i'm ready with the audio recorder
BEHANU: His new CD
warriorofyeshua: Shalom BEHANU, Isibel, David, Yehoshua, and Bruce
beowulf44: i can catch matisyahu on youtube . lotsa videos
SHeMABruce: same here yehoshua.
BEHANU: Good - 2 recordings
BEHANU: better than 1
jacqueline_54_1953: torahman are you here ?
SHeMABruce: maybe with 2 recording we won't mess up
BEHANU: exactly bruce
jacqueline_54_1953: BEHANU torahman is goingto record also for his room...
BEHANU: 39 people - 1 lash for each
BEHANU: 1 more tune!
Isibel: One more song?
SHeMABruce: i'm sure the file size will be HUGE until it is exported to a different format, however.
sherryr: Behanu, I watched Ushpazim, is there somewhere in Torah it talks about the four species?
warriorofyeshua: rofl BEHANU
jacqueline_54_1953: yes behanu I watched it also. and now i know what you meant about be careful what you pray for lol
BCWoman61: sure another song would be good so I can get that coffee behanu ordered
BEHANU: this is psalm 121
Isibel: Psalm 121
BEHANU: yes sherry
luminous_spirit: i think i need to leave and return.. i still don't see a mic.. or maybe i should just leave it.. since i can hear
BEHANU: yehoshua
BEHANU: can you get the verses for betty
warriorofyeshua: hoo hoo. Yosef Kardurner
YehoshuaBA: hold on
Isibel: mah kara?
Alert: An admin left the room: SHeMABruce
Isibel: warrior you dont like Karduner?
Isibel: lol
BEHANU: Ushpizin is a GREAT Torah movie -- rent it asap!
Alert: An admin joined the room: SHeMABruce
dawidh_nz: lol
dawidh_nz: i bought it
warriorofyeshua: yes Isibel, I like Kardurner
BCWoman61: luminous, you can reboot the room without leaving.
dawidh_nz: i've been waiting for them to make the sequel
dawidh_nz: but they haven't
Isibel: Ok misunderstood
Strider_100: i don't see mic either ... but sound is good
warriorofyeshua: I see mic
warriorofyeshua: so...
Wesleyismyname: i see mic
SHeMABruce: this song is also nice. Which i could understand it. Rats! I hate being hebrew iliterate.
luminous_spirit: it sure is Strider
dawidh_nz: isibel.. have lyrics anywhere?
Isibel: OK we will hit the highlights of the intro
luminous_spirit: i love this music
Isibel: put if you have the book read it all its very nice
SHeMABruce: Isibel, say "when" so we can start recording
Isibel: I will read the sections for everyone
Isibel: Yes Im just getting my stuff organized
Isibel: then ok
BEHANU: organized?
BEHANU: not that!
BEHANU: lol
warriorofyeshua: rofl... BEHANU, you saying she isn't organized?
warriorofyeshua: lolol
BCWoman61: isn't that the whole point of Derech hashem Behanu?
BEHANU: yes bc
BEHANU: you took words out of my mouth
BEHANU: WHEN?
BEHANU: record ....
dawidh_nz:
jacqueline_54_1953: no warrior the opposite.. he is the one who less organized than the wife is
dawidh_nz: woo hoo
dawidh_nz: no sound
renkablue: no sound
Isibel: ok
BEHANU: 1 sec
BEHANU: switching to mic
dawidh_nz:
BCWoman61: she's switching from sound card to mic
BEHANU: lo tech
warriorofyeshua: ah crap, we got a storm starting... now
warriorofyeshua: Shalom everyone
BEHANU: ancient chinese sage
BEHANU: lo tech
BCWoman61: Behanu send the 9 year old
warriorofyeshua:
dawidh_nz: 10
dawidh_nz: 9
dawidh_nz: 8
dawidh_nz: 7
renkablue: nd
renkablue: no sound
YehoshuaBA: 1
BCWoman61: 1 good Isibel
renkablue: 1
LevEchad: 1
jacqueline_54_1953: hey youngin make sure you dont' float away in that rain..
dawidh_nz: yes have lift off
SHeMABruce: 1
Wesleyismyname: 1
TwinkleInHisEye: 1
luminous_spirit: 1
dawidh_nz: yes
LevEchad: yes hear
LadyOfWisdom: 1
YehoshuaBA: 1
SHeMABruce: 1
jacqueline_54_1953: 1
dawidh_nz: yes
dawidh_nz:
BEHANU: 1
BEHANU: 1.1.1
BEHANU: Ramchal = Rabbi Moshe Chaim Luzzatto ... mid 1700's
davidebyrum: has the class started yet
BEHANU: Aryeh Kaplan
BEHANU: just now david
davidebyrum: ok, thanks...can I record for my records so I can listen again and again
YehoshuaBA: sherryr: read Lev 23:40 - that is where the four species comes from. There is commentary about in the Talmud and other Jewish writings.
SHeMABruce: Please restrict your texting please so that attention can be focused on the speaker. If necessary, the admins will have to act to insure this happens.
Marciyah: is anyone recording this?
BEHANU: yes
Marciyah: k
Marciyah: 7
BlkPraiseAngel: 1
luminous_spirit: 1
dawidh_nz: i'll want a copy cause i have to run off to work soon
Wesleyismyname: 1
BEHANU: 1
rachelkeane: y
BEHANU: in text
jeremiah3131: i'm staying out of this so u do not have to worry about this side of the peanut factory
BEHANU: If you have a Q on something she is saying - it is OK to put it in text
SHeMABruce: there are multiple recording efforts. The recordings will be made available when they are formatted properly for distribution.
SHeMABruce: The material being discussed in shown in the room banner shown about the chat area of at the top.
SHeMABruce: above the chat area
SHeMABruce: Discussion is occurring of the material shown above the chat area in the room banner.
sherryr: Ty YehoshuaBA
SimchatTorah1880: hi YehoshuaBA
BEHANU: ok we will not start part 1.1.1
BEHANU: now start
A D A M_3: what page please
Marciyah: 31
Marciyah: 32
SHeMABruce: Discussion is occurring of the material shown above the chat area in the room banner. Please limit your texting to specific questions regarding the material.
SHeMABruce: Point: The overriding purpose of the book is to bring you into a relationship with The Almighty Creator God.
SHeMABruce: Point: God is unity to the utmost - an absolute ONENESS.
BCWoman61: spelt ein sof?
SHeMABruce: yes, BC.
BEHANU: Ein Sof = Without End
Wesleyismyname: no end
SHeMABruce: ONE entity with multiple aspects/characteristics.
BCWoman61: hebrew characters pls
Marciyah: when can we ask questions?
SHeMABruce: Discussion is occurring of the material shown above the chat area in the room banner. Please limit your texting to specific questions regarding the material.
BEHANU: you can type in text if on the current topuc
SHeMABruce: Marci, if you type a question, i assume it will remain in the window and be available later for answering by scrolling.
BEHANU: topic
Marciyah: I will wait
BEHANU: we will have a break for questions on mic ... limited to what was discussed ... 30 seconds per
SHeMABruce: I recommend, perhaps, that you open a simple "Notepad" file window and type questions as they come to you, then later you can read you questions. This will prevent you forgetting your question.
Marciyah: I always have a note pad bruce
luminous_spirit: me too Marci.. and post-its
SHeMABruce: Point: It is IMPOSSIBLE that a being NOT exist who is not bound by physicial laws. Such a being MUST exist.
jacqueline_54_1953: behanu PM please
SHeMABruce: IMPORTANT! ALL things exists ONLY because the Creator sustains them.
Marciyah: can we have a source please for them dropping dead
BEHANU: Marciyah -- PM me that Q
SHeMABruce: please define "midrash" for those who do not know.
BCWoman61: it's in the oral tradition marci
BEHANU: I will be the R&D dept
Marciyah: Bc yes I asking the source
jacqueline_54_1953: Behanu please
luminous_spirit: ty Bruce
BEHANU: Midrash are homiletical teachings based on torah principles
LevEchad: beautiful Isibel, thank you
SHeMABruce: Existence is overcoming to grow closer to Hashem.
luminous_spirit: shalom Lev.. good to see you again
SHeMABruce: Point: ONLY ONE being can be self-existent. And there can be no more than ONE.
jacqueline_54_1953: bruce please
SHeMABruce: please what?
Jean Elizabeth: hello everybody
Marciyah: hi
davidebyrum: I think she means stop posting your POINT
SHeMABruce: ok
jacqueline_54_1953: ty
BCWoman61: I appreciate it Bruce, it helps me stay on track with which section is being discussed
jacqueline_54_1953: BC then let him continue.. I can lower the room so I can hear and not see. it is not helping me . but if it helps you . .I can do so you can stay on track
luminous_spirit: it was helping me as well
olivesnr: bruce are we allowed to ask quation?
renkablue: G-d put Himself in nature so that no one would have an excuse. So did He hide Himself in Nature?
BEHANU: Let do 1 person with a question on MIC then Isibel response
Isibel: go ahead olive
BEHANU: If there are any
SHeMABruce: go olive
BCWoman61: I am fine with what the majority wants, but thank you for the offer
BEHANU: Please limit to about 30 seconds per Q
Marciyah: 7
SHeMABruce: yes
Isibel: yes
SHeMABruce: God desires to fellowship with us. He loves us and wishes a relationship.
jacqueline_54_1953: then in some aspect isibel. he does need us.. because without us he could not have that relationship or that desire fulfilled , correct?
SHeMABruce: Exodus 34
TwinkleInHisEye: yes
olivesnr: yes pls isibel if u could give us the link
SHeMABruce: Loving someone requires learning about the object of your love.
BEHANU: maciyah - come back up again if you have another q
davidebyrum: what was the question
BEHANU: the q was 'what tradition' is rqmchal refering to
SHeMABruce: FYI: Since this is being recorded, it would be good to maximize your mic's output to insure it is recorded.
A D A M_3: , Isbel,,,,,can you repeat the questions for us as you answer?
Marciyah: ok
SHeMABruce: FYI applied to questioners.
SimchatTorah1880: BE is the rqmchal the author of Derech Hashem
josephm153: Bruce I have to go how can i get a copy of this?
BCWoman61: Adam Marci's question was on Page 31 the Ramchal references traditions from the Patriarchs and Prophets, which ones.
David_42: audio can be adjusted in recordings
SHeMABruce: joseph, when we format the recordings so that they can be distributed, I'm sure we will make people aware of their availability.
Isibel: Yes I would agree very much tha is why we are here
josephm153: thanks
BEHANU: marciya - we can take a couple more Qs
BEHANU: we will resume the text after a few more Qs
SHeMABruce: don't be mic shy folks. if you have a question, ask it.
BCWoman61: but Isibel that doesn't mean he NEEDS us, does it?
SHeMABruce: God doesn't "need" us at all. He is self-existent.
SHeMABruce: He also has other created beings. He is not alone.
A D A M_3: not need....but desires to share HIMSELF with us.
SHeMABruce: right
luminous_spirit: not need in the same sense that WE need
SHeMABruce: right.
Marciyah: BC do you mean that perhaps in needing us that he is maybe inadequate? lacking .....great question
BCWoman61: right Bruce, but a little up in the scroll jacqueline stated something "he does need us.. because without us he could not have that relationship or that desire fulfilled"
SHeMABruce: "Needing" something means one cannot survive without it. God can survive without us.
BCWoman61: yes Marci, need indicates he is lacking something or is incomplete without us, but he is not
Marciyah: ok, BC i can see him needing us without being almighty
beowulf44: G-d doesn`t need us at all. he can establish relationships with the angels, no? so...why again did G-d create us?
SHeMABruce: I "need" oxygen. I "need" water. I "need" food.
Marciyah: i do not think that diminishes Him
BEHANU: Isibel response?
renkablue: G_d's definition of Love is different than human love
BCWoman61: right Bruce, need indicates cannot survive without whereas hashem absolutely does not need us or any other relationship to be complete
Marciyah: I do think the would be The Most High withouting to share with us
Marciyah: he
jacqueline_54_1953: right if i die tomorrow . he will still want a relationship with others. that is why i think it is that he desires a relationship with his creation. and i alone am not his creation
SHeMABruce: Marci, i can't understand what you just typed.
Marciyah: me neither Bruce
Marciyah: lol
jacqueline_54_1953: for his creation is more than us indivisually
BCWoman61: I understand what you are saying Marci, but I don't think any title indicates the hashem is reliant on any part of his creation to define him
Marciyah: I do not think he would be The Most High, it is in his nature to share
jacqueline_54_1953: yes BC I agree with that..
BCWoman61: I think the titles revealed to us are simply so we can grasp aspects of the whole which is hashem. We see fragments and those titles help us to comprehend that which is incomprehensible.
SHeMABruce: Also, there are those who WILL be with God, thus satisfying His desire for relationship (Moses, David, Isaiah, Samuel, etc., etc., etc.). He's already got relationships even if we choose to forsake a relationship with Him.
Marciyah: BC I agree he is The Most High all by himself but even the concept of him desiring still shows a need to me and it does not in my mind makes me think that he is in any way lacking
renkablue: His Gllorious Being existed in eternity past - unfathomible time past....it was only in recent past that man was created. He didn't need us then
davidebyrum: can you speak up please....
davidebyrum: yes
Wesleyismyname: 1
BEHANU: If everyone is ok, we will resume the text and have another mic Q@A later on.
BCWoman61: better thank you Isibel
Marciyah: Psalms says "what is man that you are mindful of him and the son of man that you think of him"
SHeMABruce: I think, Isibel, that even in some questions being suggested, that the habit of applying physical things (needs) to God is difficult to overcome.
jacqueline_54_1953: yes marciyah.. i agree
beowulf44: i keep thinking of that verse akso, marci
BEHANU: Keep in mind that as we move on in this study a lot of things will be explained
jacqueline_54_1953: with what you typed , that was basically what I was tyring to say
NO_Church_n_State: shalom
BEHANU: precept on precept
A D A M_3: does absolute love have a desire to share LOVE?\
luminous_spirit: shalom No Church